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When you’re in the Victim mentality, you might be tempted to use boundaries as weapons against your friends. Bad idea.

Today, I’m going to talk about boundaries. Psychological boundaries.

This is a continuation of what I was talking about in the last episode, dealing with the Drama Triangle and the Empowerment Dynamic.

How do we protect ourselves against Persecutors?

This is the thing with Victims, right? Victims have to set boundaries.

I should warn you first. This episode might trigger you. It might trigger a lot of you.

I hope it does. And, I hope you tell me about it, because I’m in the mood for a fight.

It’s going to. I’m telling you.

I hear this all the time. It’s such a common meme, the idea that the reason you’re being Victimized is because you’re not enforcing your boundaries. You’re not being clear and consistent with that.

You have to have these rules that you’ve set. You’ve written them down, you’ve carved them in stone, you carry them around with you, and you’ve tattooed them on the inside of your eyelids, and they’re always there and you know what they are, and you’re just ready. Ready to pull them out any time anybody starts to attack you.

You’ve got those boundaries, and you’d better make sure that they know about it. You better make sure that you tell them about those boundaries. Because, at the end of the day, it’s their responsibility to make sure that they don’t violate those boundaries. I hear this all the time. And that’s the expression: people violate your boundaries.

When your friends do this, you’ll say to them “hey, you violated a boundary., You crossed a boundary. ” 

People have said this to me. They say it all the time.

Well, I’ve had enough of it. Now, it ‘s my turn to violate some boundaries. This is all about Victim-blaming. Let’s get that clear. I don’t think it’s clear enough. Hopefully, it is now.

Hopefully, you understand that I don’t respect your boundaries. That’s not what this is about. This is not about respecting your boundaries.

I view myself as a Challenger. When I’m a challenger, my job is not to make you feel comfortable. Your boundaries are not there to make you feel comfortable.

I don’t care about that. I’m not going to put that responsibility on you, with my boundaries. My boundaries are not for that purpose. It’s not a weapon I use against. you. It’s not a test that I put my friends through. That’s not the idea.

See, it’s all tied up in the idea of the challenger.

A boundary is a rule that you have for yourself. This is why you do it. It’s why you should do it. It’s a test that you apply to yourself.

So, if I say I have a boundary, like “you’re not allowed to talk to me that way.” That’s not your responsibility. That’s my responsibility.

If you start talking to me that way, now I have a responsibility to do something about it. I’m not going to put that on you. What’s the point of that?

You don’t have control over what other people do. Stop control trying to control it. You have control over what you do.

So, that’s what you want to do. Take those boundaries and use them to help you. This is the way that you’re going to respond to CHallengers.

If you’re viewing them as Persecutors, then it’s a different game you’re playing. Why even have boundaries in that case? So that when they cross the boundary, you’re justified in fighting back? If they’re a Persecutor, why do you need a boundary?

But, people in the Victim mentality don’t look at it that way. They’re very reluctant to call people Persecutors. Why, because then you’re a Victim? Is that what it is?

Very reluctant to call people Persecutors outright. And yet, still somehow that’s how you look at everything. But, you won’t say it.

“My friends would never talk to me that way.”

“You crossed a line.”

Give it a rest, come on.

Obviously, your friends are talking to you that way. Why else would I talk to you that way?

This is your responsibility. You do something about it. Do you want to be my friend, or not? If you do, deal with it. Have your boundary. It’s your responsibility to enforce it, not mine.

This has to be said. I can’t stand this anymore. You’ve all crossed a boundary, you know that? You’ve all violated my boundaries. Now, I’m holding you accountable.

I’m not going to tolerate this anymore. I’m going to speak my mind. This is your problem now. Not my problem. I made my boundaries very clear! I’ve said this over and over again.

And still, you continue to do it. You refuse to listen. Even though I’ve said it. Not my responsibility to teach you. Not mine.

Come on, a real friend wouldn’t treat me that way.

Well that’s it. I’m just going to have to set a boundary now. Once and for all, I’m just going to have to stand up for myself. Enough is enough. I’ve been putting up with this for far too long. And it’s not just you. Everybody treats me this way. Enough is enough.

So, what do you do, when somebody’s giving you a hard time?

Do you view yourself as a Victim, or a Creator?

I’m going to assume that you view yourself as a Creator. That’s how I’m going to look at it. I just won’t look at it as if you’re a Victim. That’s not of any interest to me. I refuse to look at it that way. That’s my boundary.

When you start acting like a Victim, and talking to me as if you’re a Victim, I’m going to set a boundary right there. I will not go there with you. I will not treat you as a Victim, no matter how much you’re insisting that you are. I’m just going to treat you as a Creator. THat’s it. Very simple.

If you call other people Persecutors, I’m not going to go there with you.

I’ll listen to it, sure. You can talk to me about those things. But, I’m not going to play along with that.

When you tell me someone else is being a Persecutor, I’m going to hear it as if they’re a Challenger. As if they’re the good guy in the story. Because this is your adventure. This is your Creation. That’s how I look at it.

You should look at it that way, too. When you do, things are going to be a bit different, because the concept of a boundary is going to change.

You’re going to see that what the Challenger is doing to me is a good thing. Like, this is why I’m on this trip, is to face these things.

This is what a boundary can do for you. It can help train you. I can teach you something. That’s the exercise you’re doing. You want that. You want those opportunities to enforce boundaries. 

I was talking to a friend the other day, and the story that I was hearing was how her mother is somewhat controlling, and my friend hears from other people about the mother’s behavior, and she feels some responsibility to protect those people from her mother.

That causes a lot of stress. A ton of stress, because when someone is annoyed with you, it’s like you suddenly have to drop everything you’re doing and tend to that problem.

So her response has been that when somebody talks to her about this, she says “don’t talk to me about this. Talk to my mom. She’s a grown adult. Don’t bother me about her behavior”. 

Obviously, she sees a need for some kind of boundary there. People just can’t say these things, and her mother can’t be imposing on her. It’s a huge distraction. How do you live your life that way?

But, let’s go a little bit deeper into that. In that mentality, you’re viewing people as Persecutors. Viewing your mother as a Persecutor, you’re viewing the people who are getting on your case about her behavior as Persecutors.

Let’s turn the whole thing around, and look at it from the Empowerment Dynamic. You want to view everyone as Challengers, because you’re the Creator. It’s all about what you’re trying to create here.  You can use these things as opportunities. They’re exercises, they’re challenges, they’re things you can push against to help you move in the direction you’re trying to move in.

So, if someone says to you, “can’t you control your mother?”

You say: “you’re the one who feels uncomfortable because of my mother’s behavior. Don’t make that my problem. It’s not my responsibility to take care of your feelings right now.”

That’s what’s happening right here, in the moment.  It’s very different from putting the responsibility on the mother and saying “it’s not my problem.”

No, put it on the person saying it to you.

“But Michael, isn’t that the drama triangle? Aren’t you viewing yourself as a Victim, and you’re viewing the other person as a Persecutor?”

No, that’s not what it is. I’m seeing myself as a Creator here. I am learning how to talk back to people. I’m learning how to create boundaries. That’s the creation.

Every time that somebody brings it up to me, every time that somebody gets on my case because of my mother’s behavior, is another opportunity for me to practice. It’s another opportunity for me to build that creation.

These are good things, and you want to seek out these opportunities.

It’s not about the language. It’s not about the form of it. It’s not about whether you’re calling yourself a Victim or whether you’re calling yourself a Persecutor. Those are just words.  

The difference between a Victim and a Creator is not about the language you use. It’s about the function of it. It’s about how it actually works in practice. See, it’s totally different.

The Creator is totally intentional about the creation. You deliberately decide what you’re going to create, and as things come up, you use them to help you, because you’re the one who decided what the mission is. You decided where you’re going to go. You decided that, ahead of time.

You will use these things, every one of them, as an opportunity.

But the Victim doesn’t look at it that way, because the Victim says “I’m just sitting here trying to do my own thing , and all of you people keep messing it up for me.” That’s the Victim mentality. It’s the exact opposite.

The Victim is inherently about the idea that we don’t want to change. We don’t want to adapt to circumstances. But the Creator is about change, and about adapting to circumstances.

It’s not about whether you’re reacting to people. The object of the Creator is not to be a statue, totally motionless, totally oblivious to anything. That’s just another form of Victim.

You see, the environment changes. This is a total fantasy, this notion that you’re going to develop the suit of armor when nothing is ever going to get to you. This is totally unrealistic, it can’t happen.

The environment you live in is too volatile for that. It just can’t happen. You don’t even want to go there.

Your object is always to be flexible, and flexibility means you’re able to adapt to your environment as your environment changes.

From one perspective, this is going to look like reactivity. Like you’re just reacting to what people do, like you’re just letting them control you. Sure, let them control you. You can’t stop that from happening. They’re going to control you. They just are.

The question is not, “are they controlling your behavior? “, but “are they pulling you away from your mission?”

Your creation, the thing you are trying to make.

Now, if your creation is, I hope, some behavior patterns where you are an independent human being who is capable of pursuing the things that you care about, and that you are trying to create good in the world, and not simply try to avoid evil. If that’s what you’re trying to do, great. And there’s a certain type of boundaries that are going to help you with that.

You have to understand the distinction here, because from the naive point of view, they look so similar to each other. They really do.

Go look at my Facebook account. You have to be my friend I guess, but yeah. You may say, “Michael you certainly are acting like a Victim . “

Yeah, okay. I act like a Victim.

 I mean, that’s your perspective. That’s the way you’re telling the story. If you want to be a Rescuer, you’re going to tell the story that way, as if I’m acting like a Victim, because you want me to be a Victim. Rescuers love Victims. It gives you meaning and it gives you purpose in your life. You get to help me fight.

And, if you’re particularly enlightened, you might say “I’m going to help you become a Creator. I’m going to help you get out of this Victim mindset.”

Uh huh.  Okay.

I hope you’re doing that as a coach, and not as a Rescuer because if your Rescuer, it’s going to be stressful for you too.

I’m being a Creator. No matter how many horrible things I say about other people, I’m a creator. I’m not trying to create peace and quiet. That’s what the Victim does. The Victim is an anti-creator. The Victim wants to create nothingness. But the Creator wants to create something.

 What I’m creating are Behavior patterns in my nervous system that are deliberately chosen. I choose them very deliberately, because these are the kinds of responses I want to have. When somebody is acting this way, when somebody is bullying me, whatever they’re doing, I want to create something. I want to have a response to that that works for me.

That’s going to involve diving right into these things. Because that’s what they’re doing. They’re bullying me. They’re acting like a Persecutor. That’s the frame that has been created. I have to dive right into it and deal with it. That’s where you have to deal with the mess. It can’t be anywhere else. You can’t just detach yourself from the situation. Just not going to work.

So, triggering is good. You have to trigger. You have to go right into it.  You can’t avoid it. 

Everybody wants to avoid it. I get it. But, it’s not going to work. It’s just going to cause more problems for you, because that’s the agenda that you have to begin with: to avoid these things. But, don’t avoid it. Go into it.

When my friend is trying to set a boundary here, when these people are getting on her case about this, anything she says trying to get these people to go away, bad idea.

She wants to learn how to stand there like a tree in the wind. You’re not letting it blow you over. You have to wave back and forth.

You have to go into it like “yeah, this is going to happen.  these people are going to say these things, and I’m going to respond this way. It’s fine. I’m not going to resist it. I’m just going to respond.”

That’s going to feel challenging. It’s not going to feel easy. These are patterns that go back a long time. You’re fighting against your own conditioning,  But that’s what you have to do.  

That becomes the game. That’s the adventure you’re on. These things come up in life, and you say “here’s a conditioned pattern. Let’s see if I can just roll with it. Let’s see if I can not go with that particular response, but pick something else.”

That’s different from saying we’re going to avoid the situation altogether. It’s good when people say these things.

So, I hope that she will willingly go into these situations, and not view them as something that needs to be avoided. Because, they don’t.

Every single one of them is good. Every one of them is a new opportunity for practice not allowing other people to pull you into their strange Victim world, where  they get to say things like, “your mother is misbehaving. I don’t want to have to deal with that. “

Well, tough luck.  You have to deal with it, because it’s not my problem. You’re the one who’s feeling uncomfortable right now. Don’t make that my problem.

 “Stop acting like a Victim!”

If you aren’t comfortable that I’m acting like a Victim, again, not my problem. You deal with that. You need a therapist. Don’t put that on me. I’m not the one responsible for that. I’m doing my own thing here. I’m creating something.

You see the difference between that and the actual Victim mentality?

No, you don’t see the difference, and you shouldn’t see the difference, because the difference only exists in my own mind. It’s an internal, subjective experience.

The words may sound just the same. That’s the way our language works.

The whole language that we speak is based on the idea of Victims and Persecutors. It’s really hard to find another way to talk. You know the difference, inside. You should know. If you don’t know the difference, then that’s where you need to put your attention.

Are you trying to create something, or are you trying to avoid something?

You’ve got to practice this. You can’t just listen to me talk about it. It’s not going to do anything for you. It’s all just intellectual.

Do it. Live your life. Figure it out.

Transcript

The first episode is about the Drama Triangle and the Empowerment Dynamic. The drama triangle is invented by the psychologist Stephen Karpman, and the Empowerment Dynamic comes from David Emerald.

Most of us look at life in terms of the drama triangle. every interaction you have with other people, you put yourself and other people into one of three roles.

You’re either the Victim, the Persecutor or the Rescuer. You could think of this like you’re either a Victim, a Villain, or Hero.

We’re taught to do this. This is the way the culture is, this is the way we are. All the time. We take it for granted. We don’t even notice that we’re doing this. It’s a specific way of thinking about things. A specific way of structuring our reality. And we take it for granted.

It’s not a good thing or bad thing. It’s just a thing. It’s just how we do it.

 the whole structure of our society is based on this concept. You have a Victim and yellow Persecutor, and the Persecutor is doing something bad to the Victim , and The Rescuer has to save the Victim from the Persecutor. We take it for granted.

Everything we do. You go to school and this is how it is. All these Notions about fairness, about Justice, all these ideas are based on this concept that there are good guys and there are bad guys. There are Victims and there are Villains. And, either we are a Victim, or we are a Villain, or we need to rescue the Victims from the Villains.

You may say, “well, obviously.” it seems so obvious that this is just how it has to be. Because, if someone is suffering, then it means that someone else has caused it. And, and if you can see that someone is causing it…

 what is the conclusion that you draw from this, when you see that somebody is suffering as a result of something that someone else did?

The way that you link these two events together, it’s up to you. It’s not obvious. It’s not just a foregone conclusion that this is just how it’s going to be. It’s not.

You think it is, right?

Why do you do that? You have to ask yourself this. You have to take yourself to task here. Don’t just take this for granted. That’s a big mistake, come on. Huge mistake. Don’t take these things for granted.

You know, you’re the one who’s responsible for this, You’re the one who’s telling the story.

Nobody wants to be a Victim. Nobody wants to be called a Victim. If I call you a Victim, what happens? I become a Persecutor. Immediately. If I tell you that you’re letting someone else take advantage of you, if I tell you that you are the one who’s responsible, that you are the one who is responsible for your own suffering, you see me as a Persecutor.

Why is that? Why don’t you want to hear that?

I mean, I don’t like hearing that either. I don’t like hearing it. Nobody seems to like hearing this.

Sometimes I’ll say something, and somebody else will think I’m saying that. Because, we know that it’s not good to be a Victim. We know that.

But, why is that the story you’re telling? Why is the drama triangle the story that you’re telling? Why do you put everything into that framework, into that little triangle? Why? Why is that the way it has to be?

You know, the way that you interpret events is that you take the things that happen, the things that you could observe objectively, and you string them together. You connect the dots and you make a story out of it. You find some interpretation on it.

Your mind does this automatically. You don’t even know that you’re doing it. Most people don’t even think about this kind of thing. It just happens.

This is how you’ve been conditioned. this is how you heard people talk around you. These are the stories you’ve heard, this is what you’ve seen on TV, this is the behavior that’s been modeled for you. Since you were a little kid, this is what has happened. These are the roles that people play, and these are the rules that people follow, that they have to follow. And, when something happens, these are the consequences that must follow.

We blame people for things, when something bad happens. We say that it’s somebody’s fault. we say, they deserve something.

I didn’t invent these words. I didn’t. Not me. You’re the one who invented these words. I didn’t. You. Not me.

It has nothing to do with me, because I don’t speak that language. That’s my choice. But, you do, right?

Why? Because you want to be a Rescuer? you obviously don’t want to be a Victim, but sometimes you’re forced to. If somebody does something to you. somebody says something to you that you don’t like.

“Oh, no no no, Michael. It’s not that I don’t like it, it’s an offensive thing. It’s inherently offensive.”

Yep. Uh huh.

Inherently offensive.

No, the problem is that you don’t like it. You. Why? Because it’s your preference. You would prefer that those things weren’t said to you.

Yeah, okay. That’s not even true. You prefer that these things are said to you. That’s why you get so excited when somebody says it. When somebody offends you.

You love that.

Why? Because now you get to be The Rescuer, and now you get to save the world from that person, from that evildoer. you get to jump to the rescue. you want me to offend you. You’re just waiting for it. You’re just itching for it.

That’s great.

So, you want to be a Victim, and you want to be a Rescuer. But, you don’t want anybody to call you that. You don’t want to be called a Victim. Do you want to be called a Rescuer? I don’t know. You tell me. What about a Persecutor? Do you want to be called that? Do you want to be a Persecutor?

 of course not. Nobody wants to be a Persecutor. You see that as an evil thing. Right? When you’re a Persecutor, that means that you are bad. That means that you deserve punishment. You did something wrong,  because you made somebody else suffer.

 Think of all the ways that you spend all your day, that you spent all your time and energy, trying to avoid being the Persecutor. How much time do you spend on that?

And when you do something accidentally that causes suffering, what happens? You beat yourself up about that, you feel guilty about that, you feel ashamed about that, you try to fix it. You’re spending all your time doing this, because you don’t want to be a Persecutor. That’s a bad thing too.

Is this fun for you, to live your life that way? In that drama triangle?

I doubt it very much.

There’s an alternative. The alternative is the empowerment dynamic. This is invented by David emerald.

 You should check out this book he’s got, The Power of TED*. 

In the empowerment Dynamic, we’ve got three roles as well. We’ve got the Creator, the Challenger, and the Coach. Instead of the Victim, we’ve got the Creator. Instead of the Persecutor, we’ve got the Challenger. And instead of The Rescuer, we have the Coach. These are three roles which are much more productive.

Because, you see, you are a creator. You are the creator of the universe. The whole universe. Everything. You may as well accept it, may as well own it, may as well claim it. “I am the Creator.  I am God “

Does that offend you?

 of course it offends you. you don’t want to be a Creator.

Why is that? Because creators have a lot of responsibility.

Calling you a Creator, if you’re stuck in the drama triangle, is equivalent to calling you a Victim. now, I’m calling you to task and I’m asking you, “hey, why haven’t you been created? Why have you been spending all your time running away from Persecutors? Why has that been occupying all of your time? “

when I call you a Creator, you’re forced to confront that. you’re forced to ask yourself, “hey, why haven’t I been  making the universe that I want to make? Why haven’t I been making the world into the world that I want to live in?”

And because you’re stuck in the drama triangle, this is a horrible thing. It’s a horrible thing to be called out like that.

See, I don’t see it that way. You know, sometimes I’m a Victim. You can call me a Victim, that’s okay. You can ask me, “hey Michael, why haven’t you been creating? “

 yeah, I don’t know. Sometimes I’m lazy, sometimes I’m tired, sometimes I’m scared of something, sometimes I’m hungry.

That’s fine. That’s fine for me, because when I notice that I’m in the drama triangle, I step outside of it. I don’t see myself as a Victim, I don’t see other people as Persecutors , and I don’t believe that anybody needs to be rescued. I don’t.

 The whole thing’s a game. I always think about Marshall Rosenberg, the founder of Nonviolent Communication, who says, “don’t do anything that isn’t play.”

See, it’s not that serious. But, you want it to be so serious.

Remember, when you were a kid, you created a lot. Kids are very creative. All day long, creating things. That’s how I was. I don’t need to give you examples, you know it’s true.

But then, we become adults, and what happens?

It’s not even when we’re adults.

This happens, maybe 9 years old or so? We get fearful. We get really scared, and we see that the purpose of life is to follow rules and not break the rules. And not be in the wrong. To not be the ones who are to blame for anything, because we want to be right.

So, we invent these religions where we learn how to be saved, Because we have this compulsive need to be in the right.

 We have to be the ones where the teacher can’t look at us And say, “You’re the one. You’re the one who broke the rule. You’re the one who needs to stay after class.  You’re the one who needs to clean up this mess, because you did it. you caused it. You’re responsible for all this pain and suffering.  And if you don’t fix it, there’s going to be consequences later on. There’s going to be consequences after you’re dead.  you’re going to be stuck in eternal damnation, forever. That’s how bad it’s going to get.”

That’s how future-fixated you are. you imagine this infinite future where you’re going to be suffering the whole time. That’s what it’s like for you, because you’re so obsessed with this idea that you need to follow the rules.

 That’s your thing, Because you don’t see it as a game. You see it as something that has dire consequences.

See,  in a game, when the game’s over, game over. Put it away, go do something else, and come back to it when you want to play again. You know it’s just a game. that’s fine. No problem.

But, when you make things serious, you can’t do that. You’re attached to it. You have to stay in it. You have to stay in the game, even after it’s over. When you die in the game, you’re dead in real life, so you better not let that happen. That’s how you look at it. Big mistake.

So, you can be a Creator. Just be a Creator. You’re the one who gets to decide what happened.

See, this changes everything. This changes how you look at everything else. A Victim doesn’t look at it that way. A Victim doesn’t have choices about what the Victim is going to create. A Victim is only responding to what happens. As a Victim, I need to keep everyone else at bay.

The Victim is only concerned with maintaining stability. That’s it. The whole story the Victim tells is, “I was just trying to go about my business, just trying to do my own thing, just trying to relax, just trying to have a good time, and then you came along and messed everything up for me.”

That’s the story the Victim tells. ” I was just doing nothing, and then you messed it up. “

What’s so great about nothing? Why is that the story? Like, that’s the ideal state: “I’m just doing nothing I’m just minding my own business.”

You’re going to be spending a lot of time after you’re dead doing nothing. See, this is the chance you have right here to do something. These few years, where you could potentially do something. But no, you’re just complaining about how no one’s letting you do nothing. I mean, come on, that’s ridiculous.

You can do whatever you want.

But now, you have some responsibility, because if you’re the Creator, you can’t look at other people as Persecutors. Or, as Rescuers. You can’t, because that doesn’t have any importance anymore.

 When you look at somebody as a Persecutor, that’s what they’re doing. They’re messing you up. But, you’re the one who’s deciding what happens, because you are the Creator. So, the Persecutor becomes the Challenger.

The Persecutor becomes the task. That’s what you’re doing.

You are confronting Challengers.

See, there’s no Adventure otherwise. think of any great adventure story. Just imagine there were no obstacles on the path. What is that? It’s nothing. The only reason that the story means anything is because of the obstacles. if you just stay at home, you have nothing. There’s no story. You don’t grow, you don’t change, you don’t learn anything.

 The Challengers are good things. They’re good guys. They’re not bad guys. The Victim is the bad guy. The Victim is the one who says no, we’re not going to go on an adventure, we’re not going to learn, we’re not going to grow, we’re not going to change.

And, it’s good to be a Challenger. You don’t want to be a Persecutor, because you don’t want to hurt other people. But, the Challenger doesn’t mind hurting other people, because the Challenger knows that by hurting other people that you’re helping them grow.

They might not see it that way, because if they’re stuck in the drama triangle, they’re not going to appreciate that, but so what?

You are a Creator. They are a Creator. When you’re in the empowerment Dynamic, you just see it that way. 

If they don’t want to be a creator, you don’t even hear it. You treat them as creators whether they know it or not. Whether they admit to it or not.

 You can’t have Rescuers either. No one needs to be rescued. See, the Challenger is a good guy. When the Creator is hurt by the Challenger, that’s a good thing. So, The Rescuer becomes the Coach.

The Coach’s job is to help the Creator create. it’s not to save the Creator from anything. The creator doesn’t need to be saved. The Creator is God.

You don’t need to save God from anything. You need to help God do God’s work.